I have been trying hard to avoid commenting on any political budalastina subject…for both my own sanity and the fact that I have what I consider to be too many opinions on many subject matters. I'm trying to hard to have less opinions. Or at least caring less about vocalizing them. Nekad ide, nekad ne.
An ugly word at the moment in the Federation and even more so in Sarajevo.
The following is not an opinion. It's a story of a young american boy. So it goes.
I grew up in a largely Italian and Irish neighbourhood. It was, and is, a Long Island Levittown development, so, of course, there was a little bit of everything and everyone there. Though upon reflection it was largely white.
When I went to school my best buddies were Jimmy Hulbert and Theodore Theodoropolis. One of my oldest and dearest friends was Erica Lazarus. When I got older I dated Michelle Delman for a spell. We went to school together. Played ball. Got in trouble. Studied. Had fun. Wrote notes in class instead of listening to Ms. Maynards biology lesson. I never really saw Erica or MIchelle on Saturdays. Never thought much of it. On Sunday's, I was always at church with my family. Jimmy is a protestant and went to his church. Teddy is Greek Orthodox and he went to mass with his mom and dad as well.
Never. EVER…did our ethnic or religious backgrounds ever come up in conversation amongst ourselves or with our parents. It was a non-issue. The only time it did is when Jimmy's grandmother made some delicious German bread or Teddy's dad made some wicked Greek dish.
My schooling and social life in the neighbourhood were completely separate from my family's religious traditions. Our religion was just that, intended for us and our family. We celebrated and worshiped as we chose…at our own time and place. It was a private, intimate and sacred thing. It wasn't meant for school or the playground.
People can kick and scream about separation of church and state. The bottom line is that for any multi-ethnic society to work it is a model that I am not only proud of – but am witness to that truly and honestly works. Never for one second did it take away from my traditions or belief system. That was always mine and my families – and the state fairly protected that right. Still does.
I knew Erica didn't celebrate Christmas. I always wished her a Happy Hanukah. I didn't know or understand the differences until much later. And much later – they didn't matter. They didn't matter because i grew up knowing and loving Erica and Teddy for who they were.
The religious communities here are calling SDP evil communists. If America has any phobia (we have many), it would be communism. America hates communism more than anything. We separate church and state. And it works. We are not communists.
Let God remain where need be – within ourselves. Let us learn about our beliefs in places most fair and appropriate to do so. Let our schools be for growing up learning how to be good people, good citizens, good students. Let our kids be kids…and let them love each other for who they are.
The roots of America's belief in separation of church and state comes from a troubled Europe…
"The purpose of separation of church and state is to keep forever from these shores the ceaseless strife that has soaked the soil of Europe with blood for centuries." – President James Madison
Mr. Clancy, you know, with all due respect to you and this country which accepted me as her own (talking ’bout USA here), I cannot agree with you that church is separate from the state. It truly never was. One of the first lessons is American policy I got was an advice of an older Bosnian immigrant “If an American asks you do you go to church say yest because American's love church.” I know, it is a stretch to say eeeevery American loves church but I'd say American's in general respect church and, moreover, believe in God (Jesus, to be exact).
Coming from my commencement ceremony (from Garden City none the less :-)) I was blessed by a Rabbi, spoken to by Chuck Schumer who blessed us even more so (God speed, God bless America, God bless your parents bla bla bla), to the president of the College who also, bless his little heart, blessed us till kingdom come.
I will believe that religion is separate from the state when America elects a president that is not a Christian. Just think of the stink the media made when Kennedy (a Pappist) was elected and more recently Obama.
“We separate church and state.”
a na svakoj novčanici piše “in god we trust”
a na sudu se kunete na bibliju
“We separate church and state.” – how yes no 😉
America is, no doubt, full of double standards. Bosnia is certainly no exception to that. regardless of what it may say on coins (that's pretty important, isn't it) my point was that in school – in all the places i lived growing up – there was a clear separation between religion and learning.
Is it perfect? By no means. America did elect a papist and an Obama – and yes, some will always respond with the racism that continues to poison America. Is america more religiously conservative than in the past? In some places, yeah, sure. In some places, more liberal than ever.
My point was simple. I grew up in a system where it was clearly – by law and general concensus – separated. It worked. We all got along. And if we didn't, it had nothing to do with each others religious upbringing.
I didnt grow up in the badlands of the Dakota's people. I grew up in New York.
As for the bible thing in court…yup, God creeps into everyday life all the time. But recently the first ever senator swore himself in on the Q'uran, not the bible.
Separating religion and education doesn't mean abolishing religion altogether. It means allowing the complete freedom to do so outside of public realm.
That's why the church is so strong…and everywhere you go, there are churches. Better to have them there than in the classroom, n'est pas? for now – we've managed to keep them out. Keep your fingers crossed that'll last!
moj komentar se odnosio na tvoju izjavu kako vi separate church & state
po mom mišljenju to nije tačno, nego je religija (koja god) kod vas toliko ukorijenjena u društvo da se na to i ne obraća pažnja.
što se škole tiče, ne vidim problem da ko želi imati vjeronauku da je i ima ali ako nema mogućnosti izbora ni religija niti drugog predmeta koji bi umjesto religije ulazio u prosjek, ta ocjena i ne treba ulaziti u prosjek. jedni su oštećeni jer nemaju dodatnu peticu za prosjek a drugi su oštećeni jer imaju predmet više.
vjeronauka u školi po mom mišljenju ne smeta, što vidimo po evropskim zemljama u kojima je to obavezan predmet. ali oni koji ne pohađaju te časove imaju za to vrijeme drugi obavezan čas umjesto religije i nema nikakvih problema niti neko gleda na to kao na nešto posebno, to je samo jedan od časova u školi.
Kamo sreće (eng.?) da nam sva briga u obrazovanju bude u vjeronauci. Drago mi je da postoji dovoljno ljudi u BiH koji shvataju da ocjena iz vjeronauke, i sama vjeronauka, nije toliko bitna. Dobro je i da imamo ministra sa “cojones” i poštenjem, u paketu. Samo je reakcija reis-ul-uleme neprimjerena… God save the queen, In God we trust, and there is a long way to obtain a civil society. I am sure, Mr. Clancy, that you know that we had also lived a life where religious and ethnic were at 7th or 10th place, when you get friends or fall in love. We were also multiethnic, and did not hate each other. This is not an American exclusive, so help us God.
never said anything was exclusively ‘American.’ My point was more that its not a ‘communist’ thing as many people, particularly from the religious communities themselves are accusing Minister Suljagic of.
The key difference, privremena – ‘we WERE also multiethnic.’ I'm not talking past tense. I'm talking about today.
I am no flag waiver – never was, never will be. But i do know that religion is school is not a good idea. That was my point.
Hm, I think Tim is right. America uses Bible and some other symbols, but the truth is that church is really not so influential, to be honest. Catholic church does not approve same sex marages, or many other things that American politicians are doing.
I think that people are under that impression because of the war on terrorism and recent American politics.
But I think that they are just fighting for there best interest. They would have probably attacked Bosnia or Poland, or any other country that can`t diplomatically, military, or political compare whit American. No mather which are there beliefs. Just remember the crusader wars they were going to free Jerusalem but on their way they where plundering Constantinople. It is always a battle of interest and money, really about principals. Moral and differences are basically just an excuse to start a fight.
I think that faight is a internal thing and that faight needs to be lived not only spoken. I`m sorry abo
Ops I`m sorry about long text and bad English I kinda just needed to say that.
And other thing you can know whole Bible or Kuran but if you kill a man it`s Hell or Dzehennem for you.
And my point is that in America Rais or Pope could never be involved or influence politicians in the way they do in Bosnia. They should be making peace, but let`s all be critical and say honestly do you feel like our religious leaders are sending a message of peace.
I`m trying to start kick start tourism in Srebrenica, but the not only around 11th , but around the whole year. I traveled all around the Srebrenica and surrounding muncypalitys. I saw great nature, but we are stuck living in the past. And a lot of tourist still think that we are shooting each other and driving around in tanks.
Also I think politicians want Srebrenica to look as worse as possible cause they can milk money out the foreigners more easly if it stays like that.
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